Comments about "Editorial: Time to take the lead on financial aid"
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18 Comments on this article:
Wow, Editorial Board. You fail at critical analysis.
First, you cite the Stanford endowment's size being bigger than the GDPs of many countries as a reason that students shouldn't be paying so much money for tuition. Clearly you understand why that comparison is so meaningless since you later compare the annual return on the endowment to nations' GDPs. Why, then, would you mislead your readers with such a misleading comparison?
You go on to discount the conclusions of "ivory tower Stanford elites crunching mathematical formulas". That kind of anti-intellectual imagery might work if you're running for public office, but it doesn't work when your audience is mostly Stanford-educated. We like numbers here. Your job is to convince us that those numbers are wrong.
You also seem to have an issue with the fact that Harvard is always ahead of us when it comes to making tuition more affordable. It's easy to see why they are: their endowment is twice the size of ours. Stanford shouldn't irresponsibly manage its endowment just to keep up with the Joneses.
Throughout your editorial, you question why Stanford spends so little of its endowment on making our education more affordable. Why didn't you actually ask someone? Anyone who is informed about the issue knows that students spend less than it actually costs for a Stanford education. Furthermore, irresponsibly increasing the amount of the endowment we spend every year would reduce the amount that future generations of Stanford students could benefit from. The goal is to *grow* th endowment, not shrink it.
There might be a convincing argument for reduced or eliminated tuition, but you haven't made one.
I think it's logical, what Stanford is doing. If it doesn't increase the aid and does't make it's aid policies for international students need blind it's just going to let go of so many bright people who can benefit from the system in a large way.
But, what stands to be seen is whether they actually do it and don't keep inflating their endowment.
Hey Fail - if you think the Daily fails at critical analysis, then you simply fail at reading - you say "The goal is to *grow* th endowment, not shrink it." Did you happen to read the part where it says that even if they make tuition free for all students they WOULD STILL MAKE $1.2 BILLION DOLLARS? Furthermore, "keeping up with the Joneses" IS necessary because we are competing with them for applicants.
"Did you happen to read the part where it says that even if they make tuition free for all students they WOULD STILL MAKE $1.2 BILLION DOLLARS?"
That doesn't take into account the cost of actually running the University. As I said, students are not billed the entire cost of a Stanford education. I don't have the numbers, but if the Daily wants to print a position on an issue, they should research the issue first. They clearly haven't. Subtracting total tuition revenue from the return on the endowment is vastly oversimplifying the situation.
And Re: keeping up with the Joneses: I have no problem with competing for qualified applicants, but we should do it *responsibly*. The editorial does not adequately consider the fiscal responsibility of the policy they're suggesting. This is the real world, not Congress. We actually have to worry about how we're going to pay for things.
Funny that an editorial that criticizes "ivory tower Stanford elites" also advocates free tuition...
"And yet for some strange reason, some of its students are still paying nearly $200,000 to attain an education."
"Stanford’s undergraduate tuition for the 2007-08 school year is a staggering $34,800"
$34,800 * 4 = $139,200. Food and housing would have to be paid for regardless of getting an education, so unless students are paying over $50,000 for books, "nearly $200,000" should be "nearly $150,000."
Uh, some grad students have substantially higher tuition rates, so they are paying closer to $200,000. It's not as clear, but it does say 'some' students so it is true.
Uh, some grad students have substantially higher tuition rates, so they are paying closer to $200,000. It's not as clear, but it does say 'some' students so it is true.
Yeah, Editorial Board!! You say to contact leaders, etc. Could you kindly provide names, addresses, email addresses, and phone numbers. Dont want to call the wrong folks.
Compromise: Not free if income more than 200K, pay 10% of income 200-250K, and full rate above that. Or some sensible formula so that Steve Jobs' and Bill Gates kids don't get to go free. Stanford needs the $ more than they do.
Yes, according to the registar's webpage (http://registrar.stanford.edu/students/finances/), the professional schools (law, business, and medicine) have substantially higher tuition rates. Business and law degrees, however, take only 2 and 3 years to complete, respectively. The master's degree is typically 2 years or less, especially as part of a coterm program. There are also many more opportunities for master's and PhD student funding through RA (research assistant) and TA (teaching assistant) positions, as well as fellowships, that allow most graduate students to dedicate plenty of time to their classes and research while paying little tuition.
The discussion in this article, which focuses on comparisons to Harvard's recent changes, is primarily about undergraduate education.
This editorial confuses endowment fund growth and interest earned on the endowment; they are not the same. The fund increased by 3.08 billion dollars for the 2007 year period. Inflation reduced the real amount of this increase in the fund by 4 percent to 2.52 billion dollars. According to the editorial board's own figures, you could offer free tuition to undergraduates and to graduates at an approximate cost of 520 million dollars and still have a 2 billion dollar increase in the fund for the year 2007, adjusted for inflation in 2006 dollars. You could still spend another 500 million dollars on research, construction projects (new dorms, new hospitals), ect., and and still be a conservative fund politician having increased the fund by 1.5 billion dollars for this period.
The goal of an endowment fund is to maximize payout of the fund from its earnings and asset growth without jeoparadizing the fund's economic base. The current managers are using the fund for political purposes (or bragging rights purposes with the Ivy League schools) and not for the social contract and public purposes that it was intended for when the school was founded.
When you serve the purposes of higher education, you serve the future and not the political, financial, and opportunistic minute.
As an admitted student SCEA, I now have to make the choice between Stanford, other elites, and some full ride second tier schools. Our family is in the middle class, so while we don't qualify for any need-based aid, paying roughly 150,000 for four years would put a strain on the household. It is rather discouraging having to choose between the amazing Stanford, with the 150,000 strain on my family, or the second tier full-rides. I sincerely hope that Stanford, my dream school, will make this choice easy by eliminating or reducing tuition.
As an admitted student SCEA, I now have to make the choice between Stanford, other elites, and some full ride second tier schools. Our family is in the middle class, so while we don't qualify for any need-based aid, paying roughly 150,000 for four years would put a strain on the household. It is rather discouraging having to choose between the amazing Stanford, with the 150,000 strain on my family, or the second tier full-rides. I sincerely hope that Stanford, my dream school, will make this choice easy by eliminating or reducing tuition.
As an admitted student SCEA, I now have to make the choice between Stanford, other elites, and some full ride second tier schools. Our family is in the middle class, so while we don't qualify for any need-based aid, paying roughly 150,000 for four years would put a strain on the household. It is rather discouraging having to choose between the amazing Stanford, with the 150,000 strain on my family, or the second tier full-rides. I sincerely hope that Stanford, my dream school, will make this choice easy by eliminating or reducing tuition.
Admitted student: Don't let finances influence your college choice. Going to college is probably the best investment you can make in life -- see how far you get in the application process for Google with a high school diploma. Stanford even more so because of all the opportunities you have here.
I come from a middle class family myself, but with aid my college costs are about the same as my sisters who went to state school. So what if you 15k in loans after four years? You'll earn more than enough in the future to pay it back. Case closed.
Back to the issue at hand. I'd love to see tuition rates go down. It'd make me happier. I'd also love to see nicer dorms and better equipped classrooms. Overall though, I want the endowment to be used responsibly and properly for us and future generations.
I agree with the editorial board in that lowering tuition is good. But is not the current direction of the endowment even better? I'm not informed enough to say yes or no. In fact, doing some preliminary research on the endowment I couldn't find a chart or table that could back up the university's claims. How much of the endowment actually is earmarked for special programs like constitutional law, and how much is earmarked for undergraduate education? If these statistics were made public, or more easily accessible, then the students would accept the university's statement that tuition will stay as it is. Or they could demand a change. I don't know if Stanford will do this because it's a private institution and its not obligated to. Nevertheless though, we can make an educated statement only after we know the facts on hand.
Editorial Board, while agreeing with your opinion I don't like your article. First of all, why not use your real name? Afraid of attaching your name to crappy work? I can't even find out who's on the board in the About section of the website. Second, your use of facts is not clear and convincing. It is not $200k total for four undergraduate years. The cost of an education is not $38k, it is about $44k including room and board & books & other fees. Why not use this number and ask Stanford to pay for our housing too? Especially if they require it of us for four years. You also do not respond to the university claim that most of the money is earmarked. Your arguments about Harvard envy and free education are moving, but you lose credibility when skimming over the facts especially in front of a Stanford engineering student like myself. Conclusion: Pay more attention in PWR class. Or hire a fact-checker.
Kudos to the Daily staff!! Keep up the good work and keep these issues in the lime light.
Stanford’s endowment grew by 22% last year, Stanford has had over a 15% return on investment for the past ten years, and Stanford had a $250 million dollar surplus from operating costs last year. The editorial board has brought these issues to light and is taking a lot of heat because many people don’t want the general public to be aware of these issues. Many people would rather get into “over analysis paralysis,” then help a good idea take flight.
Stanford has gargantuan endowments, enormous returns on investment, they own their land with building construction funded through donations, research is funded through donations and/or federal grants; and professors’ salaries are funded through donations. To top it all off, Stanford earns billions on their ROI, so why does Stanford keep raising tuition?
If tuition at Stanford decreased in proportion to the increase on return on investment, then tuition would have decreased by over 15 percent per annum over the last ten years instead of increasing faster then the rate of inflation.
Donations to tax exempt organizations including universities depletes money from the indebted government which in the end, leaves less money for loans, grants, and education in general.
By raising tuition, receiving tax deductible donations, and hoarding funds, the
universities are driving up costs as well as taxes for everyone.
To be sure, Stanford provides value to our society and is a wonderful university. Stanford produces captains of industry, research into disease/cures, and provides an education that helps make the world a more pleasant place. However, should Stanford be allowed to charge high tuition while hoarding money simply because of the good they provide for society?
If the students who qualify for admittance could receive a low or no cost education at a top-notch university, then more students would be inspired to do well in high school. Imagine the ripple-effect on productivity and creativity in our society!
Finally, would the Stanford’s be happy that the university they founded was hoarding so much money and charging so much for tuition? The Stanford’s could have hoarded their money, but they were extremely generous. One of Stanford’s five founding principles is free tuition, so how did the system get so out of whack?
I think Jane and Leland would be happy and very proud of the accomplishments of Stanford University. But, would they be happy with the high cost of tuition and the number of talented students who are excluded because of the enormous cost of a Stanford degree?
I think Jane and Leland would be very proud that the Daily writers are bringing these issues to light.

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